Monday, July 29, 2013

Five Manosphere Beliefs I Disagree With

The Manosphere is often accused of being a hive-minded echo chamber by its detractors. It is natural to assume that a confederation of men gathered around a few core concepts will have a large overlap in the thought process and convictions of its constituents. That said, here are several recurring ideas I see on blogs I read and respect that I personally disagree with:

Homosexuals Can't Be Good Parents - Parenting is difficult. With the number of single-parent households today, it's clear that the environment children are raised in isn't taken as a serious priority regardless of sexual orientation. Despite Roosh's well-written post on the de-masculinization of male children raised in a same-sex environment, I find the notion that gay parents will pass on their homosexuality to be doubtful at best. Until there are studies done on the comparative well-being of children from single parent, dual-parent, and dual homosexual parent households, we're all just speculating. We should also remember that most adopted children are being saved from foster homes, group homes, and other state-run environments that have serious issues dwarfing having parents who just prefer to put their genitals in different places than the majority of the population. 

Older Women Are Useless  - I covered this already in another post. Most men understandably chase younger girls, but older women are not without their charms in a dating context and can sometimes provide a more fulfilling overall experience.

Religion Is A Solution - Taking the Red Pill is about unplugging yourself from the pretty lies society has created to placate and control you. Therefore, it is incongruous that some who are otherwise "red pill" in their worldview still believe that the whims of a magical omnipotent man in the sky have any bearing on their lives. Breaking the devotion to what amounts to an adult Santa Claus allows us take even more ownership of our lives. As a set of fairy tales created by people in power to control the masses since the dawn of time, religion is the ultimate Blue Pill. 

If You Work A 9-5 Office Job You Can't Be Happy -- Most people are boring. They have no interests, ambitions, or desire for risk or excitement in their lives. Their shitty office job is not the cause of, but rather the reflection of this lack of character. Even without a dream job you can make money doing something that is reasonably intellectually stimulating and use leisure time to pursue things that fulfill you. The main drivers of unhappiness are more often the associated limitations people shackle themselves to (mortgage, wife, kids, friends they dislike, etc.) because they see their officemates doing the same thing. Office drone jobs and lack of fulfillment are correlated, but sometimes we reverse the direction of the causal arrow.

Capture The Flag - Hey, I just banged a girl who was born in a certain country. Who cares? My boner doesn't follow national boundaries, and I wouldn't turn down a girl I find even slightly more attractive than another just to get a new flag. I agree that flag count helps to describe the breadth of your game's appeal and provides a fun distraction, but I've encountered guys who regard it as a dogmatic conviction to be held above their own attraction.


  1. Agree with your entire list.

    1. I've railed against the christian right for thinking in the absolute terms that only straight marriage/parenting is ok. Newt Gingrich and others have helped prove the conservatives have helped do enough damage to traditional marriage than homosexuality ever did.

    And i do believe they can do a great job as parents. This doesn't stop me from believing the best parenting is from a stable mother and father, but i don't think 2 gay parents will make a child 'go gay'.

    2. Older women are NOT useless. Only their SMV has weakened, not their worth. However, they must factor that SMV loss into mate selection, else they will become the spinster class. Failure to know and respond to their actual SMV makes them shoot for unrealistic expectations and unfulfilled future goals.

    3.Religion Is A Solution - i'm an Atheist. I've never believed in a man riding a cloud being the solution. It all starts and ends with you and what you're willing to do for it.. not how much you pray for a ghost to fix your problems.

    4. You can find work you enjoy. But even if you can't, as long as you work to live instead of live to work, you're ahead of the curve.

    5. I've never went looking for notches, getting bangs or raising flags. This only works for a certain subset of men and if you are not that type of man.. this lifestyle will ruin you and make you're life even worse. You have to craft your strategy to person you are. Finding out who you are is the first step. Crafting your game to your goals and the lifestyle you want to lead is crucial.

  2. Guilty of the enjoying and blogging about Capture the Flag. I'm probably one of the worst offenders. I don't care about notches, but 'flagging' can't be helped if you travel a lot. It's harmless fun, but it's hardly dogma or a 'belief'. You'd be better of focusing on the Manosphere mantra that "all Western women are scum and all foreign women are angels". That's unhealthy and overly simplifies cultural nuances.

    Agree with you on the other points, though. I can't believe the amount of religion infecting the sphere. The hypocrisy of describing religion as 'red pill' is disconcerting.

    1. Thanks for the comment, NN. Your blog is terrific and after I finish the book I'm reading I'm going to buy yours.

      I see your point -- I've just seen a lot of RVF commenters say "I could have had the prettier girl, but I went for the new flag." That value equation doesn't work for me personally, but I may be underrating that people enjoy different kinds of novelty.

      The western/foreign dichotomy is another good one. I might have to write another post like this in the future.

  3. On average having gay parents, particularly lesbians, leads to a far greater incidence of sub-optimal outcomes for their children. And by sub-optimal I'm referring to a range of things all the way up to sexual abuse. (2) Gay parents are not as good as (2) hetero parents in the same way as a single parent is not as good and should not be encouraged. This is fact.
    Even with the current massive debasement of hetero marriage, around 60% of those marriages or relationships last for the length of time needed to raise children. For gay males that stat is 5%. Lesbian relationships have been reported to have a 40 to 50% incidence of physical violence. Neither of those things lead to an ideal environment for raising children to be well adjusted adults.
    Usually at this point someone points out how screwed up people are already. Maybe, but that's not some kind of logical pointer that it should be made a factor or two worse again. I doubt anyone's claiming hetero parenting on average is perfect, but it's still clearly far superior to any known alternative in it's best form.

    1. Interesting. Do you have any sources for those stats? I'd like to read up and learn more about what you said.

    2. Here:

    3. Also:


    5. Wow, nice links Anon. It really is obvious that the two-parent family evolved that way for a reason.

      That said, the real question is: Are children better off in a foster home over a homosexual home?